CONFERENCE 2016 FINAL AGENDA

[RDR]

Over all it's scary stuff the lack in general of resolutions, if it wasn't for the sections or whatever they are called then it could have been a lot poorer :oops: Maybe it was a genuine reason for not having any from Reg 1, maybe not, but to then not take the opportunity to submit amendments is mystifying, maybe they're saving it for an emergency resolution o_Oo_O

[strontium dog]

RDR

Who knows but somehow I doubt it.

Old or new. Communication and representing the members is none existent.
And you know me, member from day one in the job and shared a pint with you at various meetings and conferences. Even a cheeky wee curry Saddens me to say it, but I fail to see what the FBU does for members or me as an individual these days.

And dark days if what you hear round the mess room is true, a lot of lads and lassies leaving or about to.

[RDR]

Aye well ye auld dog, I would always advocate being part of something if you ever have any hope of changing things to more the way you see things, being on the outside is kind of letting "them" whoever "them" is, away with it :eek:

As you say we have exchanged views in the past and face to face and even with a crowd (meeting ), no one ever doubted that cuts and more cuts were coming, it's about how we deal with this, conferences could have been helpful to set down a position, intention, a marker and sent a signal to the management and government. It would also have informed the Scottish membership of what was planned ahead of the inevitable cuts

Have you had any reason why no resolutions or amendments?

[strontium dog]

Other than our district rep getting ready to resign, we haven't heard a thing. Can't even get a run down on what happened at Springburn.

It really is becoming a huge issue for the members I speak with. On my own station and when DD guys in with us.

People really are scunnered with the complete lack of information regarding what's to come. Can't even get to see a copy of the ROSE report. Just the usual speculation and rumour.

One thing is for sure, cuts and lowest common denominators are not far off. Everyone acknowledges this yet the members are left in the dark. Management already have their spin machine in action but a deathly silence from StEunochs. Disappointed as I honestly thought the wee man would be more vocal and keep us all informed.

Even if there is a reason why they can't tell us what is being discussed or negotiated, at least tell us that they are 'on it' but can't go into detail!

Sorry to steal your phrase Smoothie, is it trade marked ;-)

[RDR]

Aye well I could have told you about napoleon, only serves Matthew in his big tower in londinium, how high sir.

Strange none of the old posters, who clearly still watch the site, don't contribute anymore, no doubt a London instruction.

I don't think any newsletter has been issued in the last year, and at this time when change is occurring it's vital to keep the membership informed.

I have heard that Matt wants to restructure the Scottish region and have less officials, the district elections are overdue, but no communication as to why, remember this site's reaction to postponement of elections previously, yet nothing now, wonder why,

[Benito M]

Given the level of continued cuts etc I am disheartened at the conference agenda. Some blaming the FBU as a "toothless tiger"? Well you have to say if this agenda is an indication of the memberships position of fighting the cuts you can see why the officials/leadership are so "toothless"

[josephine]

Given the level of continued cuts etc I am disheartened at the conference agenda. Some blaming the FBU as a "toothless tiger"? Well you have to say if this agenda is an indication of the memberships position of fighting the cuts you can see why the officials/leadership are so "toothless"

Blame the membership ???
Maybe you should look at the distrust the members have in the leadership.
They have been dragged up and down the garden path.
Lost vast amounts of money.
Been subjected to dodgy dealings by the hierachy.
Is it really any wonder ?

[big smoothie]

Aye well ye auld dog, I would always advocate being part of something if you ever have any hope of changing things to more the way you see things, being on the outside is kind of letting "them" whoever "them" is, away with it :eek:

As you say we have exchanged views in the past and face to face and even with a crowd (meeting ), no one ever doubted that cuts and more cuts were coming, it's about how we deal with this, conferences could have been helpful to set down a position, intention, a marker and sent a signal to the management and government. It would also have informed the Scottish membership of what was planned ahead of the inevitable cuts

Have you had any reason why no resolutions or amendments?

Would you not have to have a branch meeting that is quorate to have a resolution?

I believe that the district officials are yet to attend a meeting that was quorate.....ergo no resolutions!

[Benito M]

Blame the membership ???
Maybe you should look at the distrust the members have in the leadership.
They have been dragged up and down the garden path.
Lost vast amounts of money.
Been subjected to dodgy dealings by the hierachy.
Is it really any wonder ?

Hi Jo
Given the recognised structure to progress resolutions to Annual Conference who is to blame for a poor agenda?
You can keep blaming "the leadership" till the cows come home and nothing will change.
I don't disagree with you, I think what you are saying is with position comes responsibility. With leadership there is the need to carry out the wishes of those who elected you through a democratic process but there is also a need to "lead" and give clear "leadership".
I remember Gilchrist once saying "When I look over my shoulder I will expect to see you all there behind me". The answer was "Don't worry about looking over your shoulder as we are way in front of you".
The rank and file organised, we pushed for a much harder fight than the one we had but the majority of the membership decided the strategy (a weak one in my opinion" where we suffered no real hardship (just ask the miners what industrial dispute hardship is) and the majority decided to settle (and as trade unionists we unified behind that democratic decision even though many of us foresaw what was coming as a result).
We then organised and ousted those we thought needed to not really be held to account but what we needed to re-unify a damaged and fractured union.
But we stayed strong and the FBU lived to fight another day.
Your talk of leadership, well I have in the past held many positions in the FBU up to and including Regional positions and every position I held from watch rep, branch official, brigade official, regional official all had the same need and responsibilities to represent the democratic position of those who elected me and also to "lead" them.
Believe you me many times called a dinosaur, left wing loony and a lot worse but never were my reasons for or my personal commitment to leading ever questioned (although many times I was told I was mad, that no one would thank me, and when I had driven myself into the grave I would be soon forgotten).
Every debate I had, either as a group or one to one I forcefully (some would say too forcefully) put forward my position, but I always respectfully listened to theirs even though I didn't agree and would try to persuade then otherwise.
So do I blame the membership?
To some degree yes I do. If you don't play your part in one of the most democratic processes I have ever experienced then you must shoulder some of the blame.
Do I blame the official?
To some degree yes I do. But that is officials of every level that are not doing what they should and carrying out their responsibility to lead. But I also blame those who do not have the courage of their conviction to step up to the plate in a "lay official" trade union or through their own selfishness' won't step up.
Do I blame the government?
Of course I do.
Do I blame society?
Yes I do and the demographics of todays society no longer has the socialist beliefs that used to bind our communities rather than the capitalism of today that divides us.
Do I blame the Labour Party?
Most certainly, as career politicians the last 25+ years of the party had been a disgrace and has betrayed the working classes.

So they have not in my opinion "been dragged up and down the garden path", they have gone where they were willing to go, some have followed like sheep and others continue to moan but play no part.
Have "they lost vast amounts of money"? Well don't ask me ask the miners.
"Dodgy dealings by the hierarchy"? Lay official union with the structure for votes of no confidence so if so the members could deal with this?

You cannot escape the simple fact my friend that conference agenda is set by the members through the democratic structures of the union. It is their parliament. And if like general politics they decide to play no part then they get whatever is given.
I have plenty of scars of criticism by members over the years so my comments are from my experience of the reality of being a lay official for the FBU and not as someone just spoiling for an argument.

[bill.advanced]

Yet another fine post Benito.
Of course the membership and their intransigence, lack of concern, and lack of interest can, and do create many problems, and therefore collectively must bear some responsibility. You can't blame all that's wrong in the fire service on the leadership of the FBU. But let's not dwell on who is to blame within the FBU. The real villains are not even members of the FBU, they are not even members of the fire service. The real villains reside in their second homes in London, paid for by the tax payers.
They have their lackies do the dirty work for them, they used to be members of the fire service, but they are no more than yes men now.